Turnabout: Tina Spring interviews Colleen Pelar

Turnabout: Tina Spring interviews Colleen Pelar


welcome back to Unleashed at work and
home, the podcast dedicated to helping pet professionals feel less stress and
find more joy in their daily lives and today’s a special episode it’s
episode number 50 I can’t believe we’ve made it to number 50 so so in
celebration of that there had been a request that we do a turn about episode
in which someone interviews me and the person I invited to interview me is Tina
Spring of Sit Happens Dog Training and Behavior because she is an awesome
interviewer and so much fun that I thought it was great to talk to her so
welcome, Tina. well thank you for having me I’m I’m a little nervous because I
get to be in control on Unleashed at work and home and I had to ask all the
questions so there is this whole part of me that goes just not much skill with it you know that’s one of the things I’m
actually your show has turned me on to podcasting and so I’m listening to a
bunch of podcasts I know you asked on the group page the other day
is there a podcast we listen to and I’ve I’ve like totally fallen for some of
those podcasts I’m like okay some of these have just real magic even just
from a downtime taking care of myself quieting my brain kind of perspective
not even I mean I know there’s really good enrichment professionally and I
think that’s great but I don’t know about you I read a lot
of that stuff anyway so yeah but those are great because they can deliver
content to you when you’re doing something else writing in the car or
whatever but they’re also so niche that you can find a podcast about anything if
you’re passionate about knitting toadstools you could probably find a
podcast that’s perfect for you right and like who knew that my
a particular swirl of weird turns out to be a genre and I also like look I’m not
spending a ton of money to go nope not that one
nope not that one though I could just try them on for size I go yeah alright
well let’s let’s get this interview on the road okay
we’ll see if my crossover train Ernest shows up all right so my first question
is very very serious very serious and and y’all I sent Colleen the questions
earlier so the first thing we’re gonna do is we’re gonna grill her a little bit
so did you read them the question I did read them pretty much I tried to warn
you okay so my first question is what is your go-to order at your favorite
hometown restaurant I thought this was a funny question because I am so not a
foodie I am the world’s pickiest eater and at every restaurant I go to there’s
like one thing on the menu that I’ll eat so my favorite meal at my favorite
hometown restaurant there’s a little place called Milano’s nearby and it’s
sort of a Greek Italian mix and what I get is the all-american hot ham and
cheese sub no tomato no onion with french fries so my husband tries all the
other things every time he gets something different and I get a hot ham
and cheese sub with french fries I’m very predictable what it makes me
happy so but I think that’s kind of beautiful
right so it’s funny when when Christopher and I were dating
there was a point that I was like you know what we’re gonna see if he pays
attention at all and so I we went to a restaurant that neither of us had been
to and I just trying to slip the menu to him and said picks up him out it
required a level of bravery that I don’t often have and he chose really awesome
stuff for me but yeah you and I have discussed how you’re really really not
though I don’t know if you remember like one of the first real conversations you
and I had was over lunch at a restaurant that we were
both looking for something kind of I don’t know maybe a little bit like high
maintenance on the low maintenance side like salad like none of the crazy in it
so um so I don’t know maybe it was salad bonding salad the salads are tricky for
me there’s a whole lot of stuff people throw in a salad but right I don’t
really don’t you cumbers in there mm-hmm right and a lot of places it’s all
prepackaged so I spend my whole meal picking all the things out that I either
can or will need and some of them have left residue like yes a sliced tomato
cannot simply be removed I know they’re king cucumber because a molecule
of cucumber it’s in there mm-hmm and it’s always in the last bite I’m
like oh I made it through the Oh imbalance right all right so good answer
hi ham and cheese with no tomato or onion yeah did you like the topping I
say yeah I did like the toffee you sent me oh well that’s good to know
okay so what do you wish you had known when you started out when I started as a
dog trainer it would have been supremely helpful for
me to have known that some of the amazing extraordinary Rockstar dog
trainers that I knew and interacted with had self-doubt that would have been so
helpful to me because it might have made me feel safer to say I’m not sure what
I’m doing because they’re when you’re being paid to go give someone an answer
you’re expected to have an answer and I had and still have so much to learn
about dogs so it would have been it would have been so helpful to me in the
beginning to realize other people had moments of doubt or or insecurities and
that comes up a lot in my discussions with pet pros where they go like oh I’m
not enough or I don’t know enough or I need
more and I think people don’t know this people don’t realize how many really
extraordinary very very competent people are kind of struggling through imposter
syndrome so I I know when I’m teaching apprentices one of the things we talk
about is not any of us not any of us know it all right and that it is
perfectly appropriate and kind to say you know what I don’t know but I’ll I’ll
do some research and get back to you mm-hm I quite honestly like the scariest
trainers and and other pet professionals – the scariest ones I meet are the ones
that don’t have a second of self doubt yeah and I’m like oh we have arrived a
dangerous mm-hmm because you know the one thing dogs are really good at is
being inconsistent right and teaching us sometimes even just teaching us about
ourselves so yeah I’m always a little afraid I again like you and I have known
each other a long time and there’s so much I admire about you and I just
admire that you authentically show up vulnerably is who you are and that
you’ve never come across as like hey I’m me I knew I know all the things I’m well
aware then I don’t know all the things very clear that it is a practice it is a
practice like even that silly puppy that you’re trying to get this it sometimes
taking that journey with their little brain and body is really fun and
sometimes the magic all right so what are you curious about right now like
Colleen Pilar today where does your great curiosity lie well
I think I’m the world’s best library user I always have a million books on
hold at the library so one that is waiting for me
is called dying for a paycheck and it’s about how stress and money issues get
intertwined you know that businesses sometimes focus too much on on more
measurable pieces than the Wellness of their employees so that’s sort of on my
nerd alert side I’m interested in anything that’s sort of about adult
development I’m taking a course right now in the stages of adult development
and going through all of that and in terms of my own personal
development I have signed up for two art classes this fall but I’m curious to to
explore art as a creative outlet again because I’ve always loved art but I’ve
always had a high level of judgment about the art that I produce so I don’t
necessarily enjoy the product so I’m hoping to learn to lean into the
experience and so I’m trying to approach that with the beginner’s minded a little
bit of curiosity to and to sort of say to learn how in some of these techniques
might give me more pleasure in the experience which will probably create an
outcome that I enjoy more – I don’t know like here you know we’re in a college
town so we have like the drink beer or wine and paint mm-hmm right and they’re
there I was so the first one I was like dragged kicking and screaming I was like
please do not do this to me because I’m not a big drinker so that wasn’t really
gonna be a piece of it for me and then it was just it was really intimidating
and so I think I’ve done it either two or three times now
the different different people and it’s funny I’m never happy with the outcome
and yet I bring it home and other people if they you know are in my office or
whatever and see this you know $35 waste of art supplies then they’re like that’s
amazing and I’m always I think to myself like
huh like what I wonder what that is I don’t think we have that when we’re
little kids yeah we’re little kids and we’re drawing the tree and the bird and
the birds twice as big as the tree like I don’t know there was a freedom in that
time mm-hmm so yeah thats related to comparison
because they have done studies on that and and if you ask kindergartners are
you good at art almost all of them raised their hands yes I am and if you
ask second graders the number is significantly lower because there comes
a time that they start hearing other people being praised for their product
like Oh Timothy what a beautiful tree you did look at you know the bark that
you’ve done on it and then the child would look at her own paper and go oh
mine doesn’t have beautiful bark like Timothy’s you know so instead of looking
at your own product you are now much more in a comparison state and it
happens right in that little window between kindergarten and second grade
there’s a big big shift it’s just sad so you know that makes me think though none
of the people who see my dorky weird rendition of a painting see the one that
the instructor for the classroom they bully see my dorky one who went standing
on its own I mean I don’t know maybe they’re comparing it to you know their
oversized bird and tiny little tree in their mind that they think they would
create so I don’t know I used to enjoy art I don’t anymore
and I think it’s I get to stiffen – yeah me too
yeah so I often think like that might be a good thing to try on at some point
just pick a medium I hadn’t worked in and try it but you know that’s something
I’m hoping to work on this fall I have lots of intimidating hobbies so a little
bit tougher one what’s something you failed at a little over a year ago I
wanted to hold a workshop for the staffs of local vet clinics and just have it
I found a facility and I advertise it and promoted it I went I did in-person
visits to like 40 some vet clinics – twice
and mailed them something and I was hoping to have this workshop maximum
number of 25 people or something and I got one and I was sad I was like oh this
isn’t right this isn’t maybe maybe I’m not supposed to be doing this
and what I realized is there’s it’s complex so all this is so complex but
time and money are huge issues for all pet professionals so there were people
who are like this is awesome but I work on Tuesdays oh okay well it’s on
Tuesdays um and it was a three night thing it was a three part thing because
I wanted to give people a chance to try something and come back and share what
they’ve learned and then come back and share what they’d learned again so
that’s me with my perfect vision of how this should be but it was not familiar
people it wasn’t the typical pattern it had a set number of times like he
couldn’t come to just one of the three he had to come to all three and so in
the time that I was promoting and thinking this is awesome and this is
amazing and this is gonna be so much fun and then it flopped I was I was
discouraged I felt like oh maybe I maybe this isn’t right
and I think upon reflection what I realized was the content is right and
the audience is right but the delivery wasn’t I need to find a way to reach
people that’s easy easy for people because pet professionals are busy and
tired and have tight budgets and so we’ve got to make it all very very easy
and actionable so like am I gonna be in a room where I have to talk about all
the really crazy uncomfortable right right and I was a lot of really
uncomfortable stuff there is a lot of really uncomfortable stuff and I was
sort of an unknown for many of these people too so the the one person who
signed up is someone who I already knew who I was so she might know was not
going to put her in a situation where she would
be uncomfortable so I wonder if it’s a little bit like what we bump into like
as family paws practitioners where people don’t necessarily think they need
help until it’s at a like really serious crisis stage I wonder if there’s a
little bit of that too like how do you you and I have talked about this with
like kids in dog stuff right the person who’s letting their kid hug they’re
usually uncomfortable dog over and over and over again it’s really like I I
struggle like do you say something because they just get mad and they and
it’s in your butt and I’m butting in which I I prefer not to do but it’s also
really dangerous and I feel burdened to not do it because I everybody’s
intentions are really good and yet it’s uh you know that’s I think for lots of
us anything where you’re like you put a bunch of energy and effort in and you’re
super excited and then like hey yeah that would have been crippling for a lot
of people perfect of your resiliency cuz yeah that was yeah that’s a tough one
it was a tough one it was a tough one I’m glad soldiered on I did cuz I
because I had more ideas like I was able to see what Susan Garen’s phrase you
either either win or you learn you know and so I was like why didn’t win but I
did learn I learned a lot from that and and I had new ideas and maybe my current
ideas won’t work we’ll see but I’m I’m excited about them and diving in with
those two just awesome well and look at all the contacts you made like maybe
more firming less hunting you know the fact so I know how introverted you are
and how difficult it is going to forty some clinics twice and going home
laughing I’m going in and they’re not gonna seize me so clearly I can have
some sort of food treat when I’m done all of this time cuz I’m I’m pretty
social and I still don’t like I mean I’ve been in practice you know since the
early 1700s and it’s I don’t like going and doing that like it’s oh it’s so
uncomfortable so bully you I actually think you won in
a whole buncha ways so and honestly if that’s the biggest failure you ever have
like you go girl yeah one person who showed up got a hell of a show and a ton
of help and and yeah they all missed out all right so what makes resilience in
the animal related services so important I think one of the biggest challenges is
that no matter how much you do you are never ever ever going to serve every
animal in need in your community so you could work 24 hours a day for the rest
of your life and you won’t ever get to say done yay
I’m done everything’s perfect and so people are really drawn to the work
because they care about their mission and you can’t finish
there’s no finish line we’re like cats chasing a laser pointer there’s no win
you know we get a win we give this little win but then we move on because
then the laser pointer moved there’s not sometimes it’s harder to make the winds
last and internalize them and feel the impact of everything you do when you
turn around and see another animal in need and so I think it it starts to wear
on people and they start to feel discouraged and then often start to wish
they cared less and sometimes with the exhaustion and the tiredness they do
start getting less they at least wall off the parts of them they care so
deeply and don’t access those I had become kind of tired cranky and often
burned-out and if we lose people to other careers or even worse to suicide
which happens quite often we all lose we all lose so if we could find a way to
help us all recognize that we’re not gonna hit the finish line but that the
work we’re doing does matter and to help people see it and feel it and feel
appreciated I think you know all pet pros are sort of overworked and
undervalued they’re not seeing that the world is going yay there’s a dog trainer
yeah there’s a vet tech yeah a groomer my gosh that’s amazing that’s not what
happens there are no parades right although I don’t know again
I think it’s I’ve been in practice long enough that I have some families who now
are coming back to me like for a third time mm-hmm and I’ve always stunned like
it orientation when they like chime in about some activity and go okay y’all so
we thought she was nuts when she the first time but this like everyday with
our dog was better because of this one nugget of information and if you don’t
learn anything else from her learn this and always like it’s weird it’s like an
out-of-body experience but you listen to me because I think
sometimes it does it feels like spring and beans without a knot in the end and
I think the so like our artwork right like all the things that I see that I
didn’t get accomplished for that that dog or relieved for that dog or made
better for that family I think that stuff sticks with you more where it’s
like oh if we could have just nailed this yeah I have tried to reframe it not
so much that I need to care less because I don’t think that would be good but
that I need to maybe adjust my expectations and remind myself what that
family and that dog wants mm-hmm and sometimes that helps
sometimes it doesn’t because sometimes I’m like what that dog wanted was a
completely separate family and sometimes honestly what that family wanted was a
completely different dog but sometimes going okay well better is better yes
progress also recognizing that just because we had a conversation that
didn’t didn’t make the shift we were hoping would happen at that time doesn’t
mean that the shift won’t happen so people need time to think things through
and to contemplate and ponder and say does this work for me and well that
sounded crazy when she said it maybe or this is
the fourth time I’ve heard it and you were the one who said it first and then
on the fourth time to hear it they go ah oh okay but they had time to to
internalize it absorb and and it’s easy for us I think to get discouraged and
like I had a conversation and the shift didn’t occur turn it I fail sometimes we
are magical and the shift does occur which is awesome and other times it’s
like okay I said like I did all the things and it didn’t yeah yeah I think
the hardest is when I can see how amazing it could be mm-hmm and then I
said why don’t I see where we land and I’m like oh yo like you’re missing the
best of it yeah yeah I think it’s a I think it’s
tough because I think we can see a different reality than than what the
family has or can even see like they can’t see what we see and so that can be
very tough and you know people are busy they’re dealing with so much stuff that
that we understand the importance of all of the pieces of caring for your animals
and making them a part of the family but there are a lot of people who just don’t
realize what what all that needs to be you know right and and I often use the
analogy of the plumber like that seems to be my go-to one of like if you just
brought a professional plumber into my house odds are really good that that
person will be able to walk through the house and have ten things that they were
like oh my gosh I cannot believe you know the sink trap under your kitchen
sink it’s not properly aligned and I just walk around oblivious all day long
not knowing that that is happening and they go out with their friends and they
go can you believe what what happened there and so for any profession there
are there’s an advanced level of knowledge
that we see as sort of the bare minimum that people should have but the people
don’t have it so our bare minimum is actually a high lift for a lot of people
yeah yeah it’s funny I for a long time I
didn’t do a ton of private work I did a lot of group work and I didn’t do
boarding train because that’s front too and I watched my business shift over
time based on what I have the energy for mm-hmm
because sometimes group classes fill you up and sometimes group classes are like
you know a fork to the eyeball and it’s not and honestly it has nothing to do
with the participants I’m just learning it has to do with where I am yeah
sometimes that’s just too much all at once and I need to better focus on the
individual triumphs that I can have one on one with a family and typically work
myself out of a job all right so tell me what resilience
means to you whitey I think the really important thing about resilience is to
sort of recognize that everyone is resilient like humans are naturally
resilient animals are naturally resilient we do everyone deals with
stress and we all kind of get through it but one of the challenges is we kind of
have this baseline of like fine and natural resilience will bring you back
to fine in most cases and we want to develop the skill set and the mindset to
move above fine to have more of the good stuff and to make the good stuff last
and stick better because our brains really are wired to pay attention to the
bad stuff which keeps us alive it keeps us fine here we are fine and alive yay
so for me what what resilience really means is leaning into it as a practice
like like you said earlier that there are going to be good days there are
going to be bad days and recognizing that that’s normal and natural and
absolutely part of life but that working your skill set in your mindset can make
the good days better and the bad days easier there’s there is magic in that
understanding what’s happening with the stories you’re telling yourself and the
sensations in your body even well and I I don’t know when you and I were at the
last family paws conference I’m sure that you stayed for dr. Friedman because
mm-hmm stay for dr. Friedman there was a there was a piece of it that I was like
oh this is a good reminder that where I am in my skin in my heart in my soul in
my energy totally and completely changes and impacts every other thing that has
behavior around me yes whether I think I’m shielding them or not
and so if my anxiety if my just being bone-weary is like a big cancer I do
think that the people and the animals around us internalize that and it
impacts them it does it and so sometimes that means and you and I have talked
about this like sometimes that means I am not fit for public consumption and
those calls before emails or conversations we’ll just have to happen
another day because I need to you know go for a drive or listen to a fun
podcast or do something else that day I wish I had known to do that early in my
career before I was drowning yeah right to know that like I just I’m becoming
keenly aware that yeah like fatiguing myself to the point
I have means if there’s a whole bunch of people I’m not helping mm-hmm maybe if I
had paced myself a little bit and done some better maintenance I might not be
where I am so yeah and really recognizing it
honoring that choice of you know I’m gonna go for a ride or I’m gonna go do
something that we are tempted to beat ourselves up for like I should be
working but I’ve gone for a drive oh that’s terrible
no no I could be working poorly because I’m stressed and and frazzled and stuff
or I could make the deliberate choice to go for a drive and clear my head and
then when I come back I will choose the absolute most important pieces of what
needs to get done and I’ll just do those and the other stuff will poof I mean it
does there there are things that fall through the cracks and okay I’m choosing
to let those ones go because I needed to focus on the best way to recenter myself
today and then do good work for the stuff that really does matter and that
this the understanding itself of compassion involved in bad is really
tricky for so many people that comes up a lot in coaching calls where people are
like oh yesterday I completely wasted the day I just watched Netflix and like
and why do you think you needed to do that because they needed it at that
point and if you needed it then you needed it but we need to work on not
always needing it right and would they would they judge somebody else about it
the other thing I will say and I tell apprentices this all the time – or new
instructors like anything you teach them blesses them it’s something they didn’t
know that you can’t download your brain into somebody else so sometimes there is
a little bit of it so people if it’s if it’s the new customer and they don’t
know that I have sparkles then if I don’t have the energy that day to bring
sparkles I don’t have to I can bring they can earn sparkles you know less
than – like honestly my horrible is better than a lot of
people’s best game and like that that sounds really arrogant but I’ve been
doing this a really long time I know lots of the things you know so a lot of
this I could mm-hmm boat in a little bit and go okay so the bare-bones we’re
gonna do this and then we do that and it’s still good teaching and it’s still
really good for the dogs and it’s really good for the family it just doesn’t have
maybe a swirl of magic that most of the time I would have performed great but
today the cost of doing that is just too high it means I’m gonna not have
anything for my family or I’m gonna be yelling at other drivers or yeah or I’m
not gonna sleep that night because it’s running through my head all the time
so I am learning that like an ice seven is good I don’t always have to bring the
world of 58 I think that’s really such a powerful thing for people to lean into
because we do know what it looks like when we show up at our very very best
and then we hold that as the bar of where we need to be and no one can show
up at that level all the time and sevens are awesome like I said it’s pretty good
it’s it’s meeting everyone’s needs it’s getting things done it’s productive it’s
you know clearing things forward but it’s and and we would absolutely give
people we cared about permission to show up at 7:00 on these situations but we
sometimes we hold it from ourselves like I would fully take your 7 right I
honestly I’m getting to a place in just age you know being 3,700 years old his
heart I’m getting to a point where I am starting to recognize for example if I
friend to friend contact you and like hey I need to talk about something I’ve
got this case whatever and you and I are spitballing that I am starting to become
keenly aware of the cost of expecting your best work every single time to you
like often I am like you know what you can totally give me
like a solid five because your solid five is better than most people’s ten so
I will joyfully take the five like I don’t want to exact a cost on you for
helping me and maybe that’s I don’t know maybe
that’s like the weird part of adult development I’m really curious to see
what you learned in the adult development class because that stuff’s
really interesting it’s very interesting it’s very interesting because I think
for me it was like and you’re an adult yeah and now I’m like oh now I’m
middle-aged this is like a total different mess yes yeah there’s some
there are a whole different levels of it who knew and and and specific
characteristics that when you start learning you start going oh that
explains so many things I didn’t understand before so yeah it’s it is
it’s very fascinating to see that but I think the more we can can really give
ourselves permission to the awkward thing is we have the phrase do your best
and do your best implies your best the one with sparkles to write good just do
you just do good good alright and I say that and I and I work with clients all
the time on that and I will quite honestly say I totally have moments
where I go wait what are you thinking you know so so with resilience is one of
these pieces is it to practice and sometimes you have to stop yourself and
catch yourself and go oh I got hooked there I was hooked and flying away and
now I need to come back and start over so you know I don’t know that you and I
remember talked about this so like I’m a Motorsports person right I have a
motorcycle I have sports cars and I like that technical spirited work and so last
year I went and did an event where I thought like I would like to go faster
like I would I would like to be better at this than I am right now and but as a
motorcyclist I learned I want to ride at about 70 percent of my skill because if
I’m riding on the edge of my skill if anything goes badly it’s gonna be really
bad and potentially you know life ending or permanently life-altering right hmm
and in a driving cage it’s a little bit different there’s a whole lot more stuff
to support you and to keep you safe and all that and I am great gear and my bike
is well maintained and all that stuff and I am careful I have a rider coach I
do education because if you’re gonna ride something where people try to kill
you in their Yukon it’s important to try to be good at that but I have never
until this moment thought in terms of why am I not doing that professionally
like if I want to go faster then that means I need to go do some additional
education not so that I can increase my 100% that by 70% moves up right not she
just use more throttle which I think in if I was to honestly look back at my
career my answer has been used up more of my so I’ll work at 98%
and then duh that when I’m exhausted and I run out of talent
it becomes life altering or potentially life ending yeah so I am trying to just
be patient with me and to go okay so you don’t have a hundred percent today your
hundred percent is seventy percent of what it used to be and that is okay
we’re just going to navigate through that mm-hmm so and in by investing in
learning more and stuff you can start increasing what you’re a hundred percent
looks like and then what you’re seventy percent looks like without overly
stressing you because you can still deliver seventy percent
but because you’ve created a bigger hundred for you because we all have our
own our own measures of these things that’s really valuable thing to do and I
think ties in so beautifully with resilience in this case you were talking
about actual skill but I think resilience is one of these skills
because because it is a practice and so when we focus on and doing it then we
can weather the storms a little bit better and we can say this too shall
pass or everyone goes through this and this there’s not really something
uniquely special about my moment here of difficulty because we all have them and
then what will I do so it’s an action based thought process
so given that situation whatever it may be what do I intend to do and I think
for so many of us when we get tired or discouraged it’s really easy to just do
nothing there’s nothing I can do I can’t right
nothing’s gonna change I mean not not doing something is a choice too
so it’s so really being very intentional and specific about what will I choose to
do in this moment and if you do nothing then own the fact that you chose to do
nothing but I think it’s the right answer mm-hmm
oh absolutely but choose it night don’t count it from the perspective of I think
we’ve all gotten that customer call or but not even a customer like potential
call email text whatever that we go yeah no no no no I’m just gonna pretend that
one got lost in the ionosphere mm-hmm because I know I’ve seen that is not my
first rodeo and that could be a very intentional and
deliberate choice and I can I can decide a road is just too dangerous right and
it can be too dangerous for a whole bunch of different
that’s right like they could just be dangerous to me it’s too distracting for
me or whatever but the same thing can be true for scenario that come to us that
that I can say you know what dealing with this individual yeah like that’s
just a dangerous road for me and refer it to somebody else for whom that’s not
a dangerous road right alright so what are some common myths about resilience I
think the biggest and most important myth is that that there’s a finish line
that there’s a merit badge that you can earn you know I just do these 10 things
I am now resilient and life will be easy that’s not true
so I hate to break it to you but I think that myth gets in the way because we see
people and we stereotype images like we talk about you know like oh well a yoga
instructor or like you know Oh green tea and smoothie folks or whatever we see it
as a if you learn this then you have that and what what honest resilience is
is that it’s something we all have but that we all can get better at and it’s a
personal individual journey there is no finish line and there is no merit badge
but finding the things that work for you there are there are themes of what
worked for a lot of people but finding the magic that works for you is what’s
absolutely vital for resilience and so that’s why so many people struggle and
fail with other kinds of programs where they you know here are the five easy
steps to doing this and you try the five easy steps and your life doesn’t change
and you go what works for everybody else it doesn’t work for me I must be screwed
up no it’s because those five easy steps weren’t tailored to you and so I think
that’s the big myth that while there’s there are absolutely common things that
the people should try they are not one size fits all and they are not one and
done so even when you find the things that work for you you are going to do
them every day for the rest of your life as a practice just like bathing and just
like brushing your teeth you’re going to work yourself through all your
resilience things and so I think that if people can approach it from back
perspective it’s a lot less daunting it’s just sort of like oh I got it I
just got to find out what works for me so you and I have talked about this in
the past in one of the group’s so do you think that there is a time because I
think I’ve experienced this like a loan that I can totally be wrong I’m very
good at it ask my mom so then so do you think that
there is a point where we’ve worn ourselves out right where the resilience
work is helping but it but it isn’t necessarily hugely observable that the
practices maybe that have helped in the past or that have helped others are
helping but though well we’re digging out of yes just deeper and so I can
remember at one point when I was seeing a therapist years ago he just would say
to me okay so your body’s lying to you so when your body says you need a nap I
want you to go for a 15-minute walk that’s it at the end of 15 minutes if
you still want to take a nap go take a nap and if you’re feeling like you need
to stay in and not be around people I want you to go and have a cup of coffee
at Panera and be around people you don’t have to talk to anybody but be around
people for 15 minutes at the end of that 15 minutes if you want to go home and
not talk to anybody the rest of the day that’s okay
and if your body tells you you’re not hungry I want you to eat something it
doesn’t have to be something big it can be a little Gail gala Apple but eat
something and at the end of 15 minutes if you’re still not hungry you don’t
have to eat anything else and and to be quite
we’re at that point in my life I breathe in and out because Justin told me I had
to and I I went to sat for 15 minutes by myself at open Panera
almost every day because Justin told me I had to and I went for a walk because
Justin told me I had to and over the course of six months my body stopped
telling me all that stuff mm-hmm and I felt better but I had that that there
was a really specific trauma kind of that had resulted in that but do you see
that that if it’s photography walking around and taking you know one picture a
day is it just an it it’s a drip into a bucket that’s been really empty and dry
for a really long time and so it kind of just gets absorbed by the bucket before
there’s the actual cumulative effect of my buckets fault
yes yeah there’s a whole lot there that I want to respond to so let me make sure
I think my thoughts through um first off I would say that absolutely is common in
that you have to just do bit by bit by bit by bit by bit and you can feel like
you’re not making any progress for a long time but it it is changing your
brain patterns and your and your thoughts and things are adding up it’s
that drip in the bucket the book it is big and the drip is small it feels like
nothing it’s hardly even there and in the beginning it might evaporate before
the next drip falls in but over time it will it will add up the part about not
listening to your body is absolutely good advice when you are at that point
of of like really deep risky kind of level but for most people I would say
they don’t listen to their bodies enough that their body will say you need a nap
and you go I don’t have time for a nap or their body will say you need
something to eat and there’s like I don’t have time for lunch I’m just gonna
you know grab something or your body will say I’m feeling very sad and up
and their brain will say potato chips but your body is actually having
physical sensations that say sad and instead of saying well let’s explore sad
we say let’s do something that makes me just feel different and and really
exploring the concept of of words around physical sensation is really very
interesting because so much of what we described is sensation tickle on your
neck your heart left you your throat closed up you had butterflies in your
stomach your face got all red you had steam coming out of your ears
these are things that when we are experiencing emotion our body
somatically are always talking to us but we don’t always listen and so having a
moment where where you just get curious about that and go wow I just had a big
emotion whatever it was where did I feel it how did I feel it did I have you know
where in my body did that appear and was it comfortable or uncomfortable what
what did it tell me did it make me want to move towards something or away from
something so for for your case I think the counterintuitive advice was very
very good advice for you for most people I would say my starter advice would be
stop and listen and ask your body because you’ve been really good at not
listening to your body ask your body what do you need and then try that first
yeah and to be clear like at that point in my life I was shattered into a
bajillion pieces yeah so the depths of where I was was a really like I will
forever be grateful that that they came in after me because I’m not sure I would
have climbed out on on my own so glad that you got the support you needed so
that yes I’m eternally grateful so much yeah I know I’m super grateful and I
will say like I’ve seen people like there’s the
moment sometimes where you look in somebody’s eyes ago I have been there
yeah like I know what that is and and have given them that same advice right
and gotten them referrals to people who are far more skilled than I am to help
them but to say okay so when I looked like that this is this is a star mm-hmm
because yeah like I’m not entirely sure what would have happened if somebody
hadn’t come in for me at that point in my life I don’t think I would be here
today definitely right and that’s you know
that’s scary looking back on it and it’s it’s it’s terrifying and from my seat
here where I see all you offer to the world I think it’s a tragedy and I also
know that there are so many pet professionals who feel that way too and
it’s just awful it’s it’s a it’s a terrible terrible thing that so many are
struggling with those kinds of feelings yeah like I just I would just say to
anybody like reach out like I’m a stranger you could reach out to me like
I don’t know the same people I’m not gonna you know turn you out like I’ll
just reach out to somebody yeah reach out to somebody because and if you
know somebody who has that haunted look like don’t leave them behind mm-hmm
because we’re really easily left behind cuz it’s agony yeah it’s not something I
would wish on anybody it was it was really hard it was all so crazy easy to
fix which was bizarre to me okay it was amazing to me how in six
months without meds by the way for those who care not that I judge those who use
Mets I think that’s great I just couldn’t afford it and didn’t want to do
it that way though there was a day that my therapist looked me in the eye and
said okay so if when you come back next week
things are not improved we are going to look at other therapy
options which was an excellent way of saying yeah we’re not staying like this
like this is not something we can maintain um unfortunately things were
better but it was amazing to me what a difference six months could make yes and
really how magnificently better I could feel on the other end of that okay so
that I think that’s the key to resilience
it’s amazing what different six months can make and I think that’s what the
Unleashed resilience community is all about it’s about creating an environment
where people can safely practice together not not people who are in need
of therapy I do not want to present myself as having skills at that level
and I be super clear I am NOT a therapist but for most of us who are
just struggling with real life stuff just the stuff the community is an
awesome experience because we can take concepts and themes and play with them
it over an extended period of time and try things out and say like that worked
for me or that did not work for me and try to find the magic sweet sauce
for each of us and so hopefully some people will be interested in joining in
to our unleashed resilience community in the fall when it reopens so that group
is just magic Colleen right like I did so so you had a session last night that
was on my book I was gonna be doing it and had kind of a rough day and so I
decided instead I put this up on the message board so I’ve already outed
myself so just put on like hey I’m sorry I missed it I’ll be there soon next one
whatever but tonight I decided to have a dinner salad and a beer and call it
self-care then I’m blending my play and really in that moment I’m not sure I
would have blessed the group right I just I just wanted to eat my salad and
drink my beer and sit with Christopher and cuddle up a cake and you know do
whatever it was I was doing so I love that there was no that other
people were like go girl like good yes that is self-care because sometimes
honestly like I think part of the magic of resilience is just saying no oh yeah
that’s gonna be wind right and that is a completely and it is a complete sentence
it is no yeah it stuns people like I love the pause after I’m like no it
tickles me I don’t do it very often alright so is there anything else I
should have asked you but didn’t and if so what no I don’t think so I think we
have probably talked people’s ears off enough about resilience and and what it
what it means for us and what it can mean for other pet professionals I’m
really grateful to you Tina for coming on today and doing a turnabout interview
with me this was fun so you are magic and I can’t imagine a time that I would
be like yeah no no my Colleen Pilar tube is full like I’m done with her yeah I
think that the gifts over your career that you have given the world are just
amazing and it’s a privilege it’s an honor to say they well I say you’re my
friend I don’t I don’t know if I’m your friend but I try to be your friend
lately that I can like when I’m handing your books to someone I’m like she’s
amazing right um and yeah so it’s an honor and a privilege to be asked to
help or to be asked to you know even be included in your stuff so yeah ask away
anytime grateful to you for that and I have to tell you in the back of my head
I’m thinking I’ve got to cut this I’ve got to cut this I can’t the podcast but
I think my growth moment is going to be trying to leave that in so so there’s a
final revelation from me of that that was deeply uncomfortable but I’m also
very grateful to you for it thank you so I love you and you’re taking care of
the rest of us you know back at you I think you’re awesome Tina so thanks for
coming on Unleashed at work in home today and go share your sparkles with
all the people who are worthy of them you too

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